tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1831276194138109948.post4131952833152043163..comments2024-03-28T10:14:58.693+00:00Comments on The Good the Bad and the Insulting: Fenris: Curse of the Wulfen Part 1 - The Lore (Warhammer 40,000 War Zone Review, 7th Edition)Bellariushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02652722543111095280noreply@blogger.comBlogger17125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1831276194138109948.post-19786019208322269892016-02-18T07:53:32.478+00:002016-02-18T07:53:32.478+00:00Don't you love it when they write in story ele...Don't you love it when they write in story elements that only undermine their main story? And to make it worse, this book gave Star Wars Episode VII a 9/10!grdaathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00722216755745063033noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1831276194138109948.post-17600224119283221902016-02-17T19:13:15.435+00:002016-02-17T19:13:15.435+00:00In all honesty, that actually sounds fairly spot o...In all honesty, that actually sounds fairly spot on given how the book depicts things overall. While most of what you describe is squashed down into a small fraction of a page, and the PDF element skipped over entirely, the section surrounding their introduction and knee-jerk decisions is spot on. Given that, to my knowledge, Annandale was given the book and then just told to adapt that into a lengthy story. I have heard of Black Library authors doing the same in the past, and in fairness it has produced some great work when they've been given a little leeway. Also some terrible stuff, but there we go.<br /><br />Also, that bit you note about bran Redmaw? Yeah, even Curse of the Wulfen actually brings up his unique state. It basically claims that his near-feral state is what's forcing him to so more actively sided with them, alluding to the Wulfen curse. All I can guess is that the book was made arse backwards, and the whole "13th are the only Wulfen" bit was thrown in later on.Bellariushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02652722543111095280noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1831276194138109948.post-81347147170371164302016-02-17T19:09:13.722+00:002016-02-17T19:09:13.722+00:00Given that he only emerges at the very end of the ...Given that he only emerges at the very end of the book, i'm giving them the benefit of the doubt and waiting to see how they spin this event. It's probably giving the writers more credit than they deserve, but there have been some depictions showing the Dark Angels lulling daemons into a false sense of security to gain the upper hand over them. In one particular case, Azrael did this to one daemon which had helped to corrupt Luthor, so that it could be trapped and then left to the tender mercies of Kharn the Betrayer.Bellariushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02652722543111095280noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1831276194138109948.post-77410032768118996582016-02-17T09:53:31.264+00:002016-02-17T09:53:31.264+00:00The Changeling getting into the Rock is honestly m...The Changeling getting into the Rock is honestly more the cherry on the top rather than the filling of bullshit (yeah there's many, MANY reasons it should be impossible).grdaathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00722216755745063033noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1831276194138109948.post-78008113673667889122016-02-17T05:10:41.175+00:002016-02-17T05:10:41.175+00:00I just listened to arch warhammer on YouTube and i...I just listened to arch warhammer on YouTube and it was basically what you said, but with more swearing. He did mention that the rock has beings on it that are anti chaos so sneaking a chaos changeling in there is not possible among other thingsAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10957826723143516060noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1831276194138109948.post-35585842790843806332016-02-17T05:05:29.318+00:002016-02-17T05:05:29.318+00:00Was listening to arch warhammer on YouTube about t...Was listening to arch warhammer on YouTube about this book and it was 20 minutes of basically what you are talking about....and a lot of swearing. He did mention that there are beings on the rock that are anti chaos and it is not possible for a chaotic being to get in there unnoticed Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10957826723143516060noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1831276194138109948.post-63457248088495341722016-02-16T01:22:34.074+00:002016-02-16T01:22:34.074+00:00So I've now read the novel (the David Annandal...So I've now read the novel (the David Annandale one, at least it was cheap, though I still haven't read the regular book). <br />It wasn't that great, though most of its problems are from the main book (if the main book was good, then the novel probably would have been good too), and apparently nobody told David Annandale that the Wulfen are supposed to be a new concept, because when the Grey Knights accuse the Space Wolves of harboring feral mutants, Ulrik zones out and says that they were all accusations he had heard many times before and that these were arguments they had many times in the past. <br />In case you're curious, the book never brings up the months of shame either. Krom says he can think up at least a dozen reasons for why he hates the Knights, but he doesn't list any besides possibly them being fanatics.<br /><br />At the very least I can kind of excuse the knights being there since premonitions and foretelling demonic incursions are what they're supposed to specialize in.<br /><br />The novel also seems to have a weird thing going with the whole wolf part of the chapter, Annandale also never got the memo that they have a Viking half (besides about one mention of the Allfather) so every mention of the wolfy wolves has them wolf their pack wolfily down a mountain to hunt their prey, and then paradoxically have deathwolf (still the dumbest name for a wolf lord) say the Space Wolves aren't wolves. Because that's not confusing, have him constantly go on and on about wolves, then say they're not them. Deathwolf's also fairly intelligent, which puts him at odds with Ulrik, at one point somebody demands evidence that the Wulfen returning means Russ is returning, or that their return has anything to do with anything, and the proof is "Well... Look at the Wulfen!" And that's enough to convince them somehow.<br /><br />The book also brings up the point that the Wulfen might not actually be the 13th company, however that makes Bran Redmaw mad (oh whoops, what mutation does he have again?) so because it made a Wolf Lord mad, obviously that can't be true, and no joke, that's the reason they dismiss the idea.<br /><br />The novel kind of comes up with an idea for why they'd do that, though it's not a very good one. The book says that they'd leave the cleanup to the PDF's, since they're in a hurry and they only want to break the hold the Daemons have on the planets, but that doesn't answer how the PDF's are going to clean this up, or why they should allow them to do that (since Imperial Citizens aren't supposed to retain knowledge of Daemons).grdaathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00722216755745063033noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1831276194138109948.post-4050240271529826732016-02-16T01:00:40.824+00:002016-02-16T01:00:40.824+00:00The Imperial Armour books actually are deceptive i...The Imperial Armour books actually are deceptive in their length, while the Anphelion project has about 165 pages, only about 60 of those are story, and about 10%-20% of those story pages are made up of filler information that's nice to know, but ultimately unnecessary (the rest is the D-99 list, Tyranid units, Red Scorpions and the Biologis findings on the Tyranids). Most of the other books are the same way, with their length being on par if not shorter than Mont'ka (with the rare one being slightly longer), though I'll grant you that at least the font's smaller so they fit more on the page.<br /><br />To be fair to the Wulfen, the Black Dragons have an ongoing mutation, if it's proven that this is a one-off and doesn't really have anything to do with the rest of the chapter, by itself (thousand sons spell notwithstanding) which could be proven by watching over them long enough (I'd figure that would still clear them).<br /><br />Maybe they just assumed the Grey Knights would show up? Though you'd figure if they thought that then they'd take extra precautions to keep the Wulfen a secret.<br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br /><br />grdaathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00722216755745063033noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1831276194138109948.post-61964818564621250862016-02-16T00:15:59.798+00:002016-02-16T00:15:59.798+00:00That's another good example actually, and one...That's another good example actually, and one I do hope to review at some point. The main reason i've yet to tackle those books is thanks to their length and detailed information, but that particular book can be talked about for having a more self-contained and focused storyline. That and a lot of comparisons can be made as to how well a new setting can spin a story in new ways, in this case the tired old Aliens style stories.<br /><br />While i'd certainly agree that the first option might be viable, the second is somewhat more dubious. Even long established chapters with such mutations like the Black Dragons are widely derided, and constantly singled out for purity tests above all others. Personally, i'd think that the Inquisition would probably want to take a pack away and spend the better part of a decade examining, interrogating and perhaps even dissecting them before deciding what to do. After all, the Exorcists were supposedly the result of a long period of experimentation and testing, and lack any truly physical deformities. These Wulfen on the other hand, well, let's face it, they physically have more in common with possessed warriors than any true or established space marine.<br /><br />Still, the real problem above all else here is obviously that the book just keeps jumping issues it really needed to explain. Hell, if nothing else, you'd think that each company would feature more Wolf Priests to try and help close Chaos portals quickly rather than just abanonding planet after planet at a time.Bellariushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02652722543111095280noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1831276194138109948.post-66252255107737436672016-02-15T23:54:25.660+00:002016-02-15T23:54:25.660+00:00You hit the nail on the head right there: The very...You hit the nail on the head right there: The very fact that the leaders of the Wulfen and various members are shown to basically possess all their mental faculties undermines their nature even worse than the retcon of there being no Wulfen. It just turns them from cursed failures into "hey, awesome, I'm a wookiee in power armour!" which plays into some of the chapter's worst problems of late, despite the improved tone. Hell, the book doesn't even properly resolve the big issue which could have saved this all: The Wulfen leaders are all in complete control and can happily talk without problems. So, rather than racing around the galaxy like a bunch of demented maniacs, why not try to interrogate them, or even telepathically scan them? The book apparently forgets about both options in favour of 'splosions!<br /><br />The other big issue beyond all else however, is the fact that the book keeps going for the easy answers. For example, Stern is only brought in because there is a rising tide of daemons on a few worlds the Wolves have visited and the Grey Knights go "I HEARD THERE WAS HERESY AND CAME AS FAST AS I COULD!" We never see it focusing upon anything else or even the long-term possibilities of the chapter bringing such ruin in its wake, or even them piecing together what might be happening. Hell, the book doesn't even bother to mention the Months of Shame once the two do stare down one another. The fact this chapter is being led by a guy who successfully fought a massive Inquisitorial force to a standstill should actually mean something here, or even that their long history of combating other Imperial institutions should lead others to praying upon this recent streak of apparent heresy.<br /><br />Also, the Dark Angels are in this as well, but it focuses only upon their rivalries and gives an easy answer. Why do they want the Wolves gone? Rivals. How do they know about the Wulfen? CCTV. Despite being one of the most secretive and clandestine chapters in existence, the story never pauses to have them realise the Wolves are pulling similar (if cruder) stunts comparable to their own hunt for the Fallen.<br /><br />Also, I'd need to go through it again, but I counted at least three worlds they had left daemon infested and not bothered to finish off.Bellariushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02652722543111095280noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1831276194138109948.post-28267450617205346092016-02-15T23:33:38.947+00:002016-02-15T23:33:38.947+00:00Yeah, this isn't the kind of story progression...Yeah, this isn't the kind of story progression people were looking for. So far this is a clumsy, predictable story which is sadly overly predictable and lacks any of the character dynamics which might have saved it. GW seemed to want to go big with this one, but in doing so they just lost all focus when it came to great storytelling in favour of repeated, violent explosions. Hell, even that could have been handled well if they at least managed to create some sense of a rising tide of violence and cost in war. Instead, everything from the 13th to Chaos itself just seems to have been haphazardly thrown into the story hoping it might work.<br /><br />Perhaps the worst problem is that it seemed the writers genuinely didn't know what they wanted to do with the 13th. Most of the time they're presented as violent, animistic and all, and even prone to the odd moment of violence. The second they link up with the Space Wolves though, all of them immediately fall in line and there are few to no problems mentioned. Hell, I can't even think of a moment where the story actually focuses upon the issues surrounding the Space Wolves fighting alongside horribly mutated versions of themselves.<br /><br />Also, yeah, i'll definitely agree that those models look fantastic and are a massive leap forwards in terms of miniature design. The Iron Priest in particular works well given how it works in older tech and more of an oddly technological mystic angle to it. I'm honestly almost tempted to write up an analysis on why those ones worked but the Wulfen didn't.Bellariushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02652722543111095280noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1831276194138109948.post-55303254553314586392016-02-15T01:30:29.803+00:002016-02-15T01:30:29.803+00:00So I'm making this a third comment, not becaus...So I'm making this a third comment, not because I ran out of room with my earlier points, but because I wanted to discuss the timeline, you mentioned that the Black Crusade just threw in the 13th company, and while that's certainly true (they were a minor force at best) is there any real reason the Wulfen couldn't have been discovered during the Crusade and returned home after it? I know that the old Wolves from the time of Russ presents some awesome story opportunities, and we can't have that, but even if they were all Wulfen, why couldn't it happen then? At the least it would give a better reason for their reappearance rather than "WE'RE HERE NOW!" If this takes place before the 13th Black Crusade, doesn't that kind of screw with Logan taking command during it? Granted Logan was replaced very quickly in the space war by an admiral who was actually good at his job, but isn't he still supposed to take command initially, or did that change in the newest Space Wolves Codex and I've forgotten it? <br /><br />Now another question I've got, even if we accepted this new fluff, wouldn't this actually be a pretty good time to advance the setting? Have the Wolves go full radical (even though they kind of are already), make them fleet based, and possibly assisted by a few Radical Inquisitors (they like them from what I remember) and have them traveling around, fighting Chaos, Relictors style. You don't need to confine them to the same planet and at the end of this say "Everything's back to normal!" Because I'm sure that's how the second book is going to end. Nothing will have been pushed forward, it's just going to restore the status quo and at worst, the Space Wolves will be forgiven for everything.<br /><br />I've also noticed that there's a novel of the same name by David Annandale, so maybe that's better and actually does something smart with the concept, though I doubt it.<br />grdaathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00722216755745063033noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1831276194138109948.post-3024142258493815452016-02-15T01:29:04.823+00:002016-02-15T01:29:04.823+00:00I'd like to bring up a much better book, IA4: ...I'd like to bring up a much better book, IA4: The Anphelion Project. The second edition of IA4 expanded upon the plot, however this makes it about as airtight as you can possibly get. Everyone in that book is very intelligent and the only way to do better than how Lok did is to use the knowledge of the metagame and anticipate what the Tyranids are going to do. Like you say it takes its time establishing things, the Tyranids don't actually show up for a good long while. It takes Lok about an hour upon landing on the moon for him to figure out what was going on, what went wrong, and that there are uncaged Tyranids on the planet. <br />Even when he's overrun and all the Imperials on the planet are killed and eaten, you learn that it actually wasn't a Tyranid victory because the Inquisitor Lord who sent Lok there had already extracted all of the information that the Mechanicus had gotten on the Tyranids, and there was a TON of information (to the point that even the Biologis in charge thought they couldn't get any more). The base was also operating perfectly fine, to the point that he had to send in an operative to let the Tyranids out because he wanted to show the rest of the Imperium how dangerous even a small amount of Tyranids could be without wasting a lot of lives and he performs Exterminatus on the moon after the main events are done so that the Tyranids will all die as well. In the end, everything he did works, a larger portion of the Ordo Xenos are now taking the Tyranids as a much more serious threat, and Varius (the Inquisitor Lord behind it all) has developed several highly successful anti-Tyranid measures and is now trying to deploy them en-mass.<br /><br />Now let's bring that back to this trash, and look at how it could be fixed. If Grimnar was open about the Wulfen and said that they came across one of the companies of their old legion and are now trying to give them a glorious death in battle, the absolute worst that'll come of that is an Ordo Hereticus Inquisitor wanting to stay with the fleet for a bit (presumably in their own ship) to ensure that the wolves stay on the straight and narrow. If they're able to prove that the Wulfen give excellent results, and show that they don't change even when fighting on the most corrupted of worlds, then I think everyone would have let them go. Hell, the Excorcists were created by making a handful of marines, testing their effectiveness on a Daemon world, and when they got a kill ratio of 98:1 the Ordo Malleus almost immediately requested that a full chapter of them be created, so I'm sure the Wulfen could be proven in the same way.<br /><br />If they said that they were current brothers who had run afoul of Chaos Sorcery and wanted their revenge, while that would be towing the line a little bit, it would still make more sense especially if they allowed the Grey Knights to confirm this. Even if they said that they weren't brothers at all, but monsters, similar to their own Thunderwolves and that they were using them as weapons against the Traitors, THAT would be enough to excuse them.<br />I know that the Wolves haven't been on the best of terms with the Inquisition since the Months of Shame, but Logan at least knows the Hereticus is not the Malleus, and he also knows the Malleus Inquisitor was just doing his job.<br /><br />THE ABSOLUTE LEAST that Logan could possibly do, is to declare Exterminatus on the planets that they abandoned that didn't have allied marines, just to stop the enemy from getting hold of them. That was always one of my biggest problems with the first edition Anphelion Project, the Tyranids would have created a new hive fleet, the Inquisition knows this, and they didn't seem to do anything to the moon, whereas the second edition stated that the plan had always been to declare Exterminatus once the operation was over to ensure that they were all dead.grdaathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00722216755745063033noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1831276194138109948.post-7237239774853198672016-02-15T01:14:40.755+00:002016-02-15T01:14:40.755+00:00So when's the new I̶m̶p̶e̶r̶i̶a̶l̶ ̶G̶u̶a̶r̶d̶...So when's the new I̶m̶p̶e̶r̶i̶a̶l̶ ̶G̶u̶a̶r̶d̶ Astra Militarum Codex coming out where we learn that Commissars are new and there's debate among Commanders over whether or not they're all that useful? O̶h̶ ̶w̶a̶i̶t̶ ̶t̶h̶a̶t̶ ̶w̶a̶s̶ ̶M̶o̶n̶t̶'̶k̶a̶ *Ahem* <br />Joking aside, this actually lost me pretty early on, right about here: "Despite their feral state and bestial nature, they recognise the astartes as their kin, bowing before them as their betters." Yeah, right as soon as you started talking about the main plot I was completely lost, these are the most peaceful savage monsters I've ever seen mentioned. A main trait of all the other Wulfen in previous Codices was that they were horrible, thoughtless creatures, and while I'm not actually all that opposed to giving them a little bit of intelligence (I liked that bit where they pick up that "ornamental weapon") having them be all buddy friendly with the Wolves is downright absurd.<br /><br />I also have to wonder what turned them into the Wulfen, is it something to do with Russ's gene-seed, or something with the Canis Helix? Because if it's something with Russ, that doesn't make a lot of sense because he kind of lacks a lot of the wolfy traits the Wolves have (I'm pretty sure he doesn't have the Canis Helix) and if it's to do with the Helix, wouldn't that screw them over for further recruitment? At least the writer's trying to balance the two sides of the Chapter though (but apparently never told the new artist, who is still wolfing away with his wolfheaded wolfbrush on his wolf-speckled canvas).<br /><br />Now the Wulfen first appearing here is ridiculous for how Stern interacts with Logan, or even how Logan reacts to them, why would he assume that they're kin? They could easily have just been some random mutants who took the armour off of dead marines (and considering the 13th company originally did that to the Chaos Space Marines the reverse could certainly happen and they've gone on plenty of mutant purges, they'd know that these are mutants, especially since they've never happened before, so why would he even try to claim that there's no taint in them when they're clearly tainted? <br /><br />Speaking of which, if the Wolves don't want to finish the fight on a planet, WHY DID THEY SHOW UP IN THE FIRST PLACE? That's one of the absolute worst things a Chapter can possibly do, abandoning a battlefield before the fighting's done, or to ignore a world in trouble, hell, doing that ONCE is enough for the Ordo Hereticus to declare you Excommunicate Traitoris, how many times did they do it in this book?<br /><br />Getting back to Stern for a second, you'd figure that he of all people would know a Tzeentch plot when he sees it, especially considering his archenemy is a Lord of Change. You'd also figure he'd be far better at discovering Tzeentch Sorcerery shenanigans going on as well, especially since discovering that sort of manipulation before it happens is something the Ordo Malleus is supposed to specialize in (it was the reason Hector Rex arrived on Vraks after all).<br /><br />Now I do like the bit about Bjorn fighting on the Astral plane, and I like how FOR ONCE the Wolves are being held responsible for what they did, rather than getting away scot-free like they usually do. That's about the only other good things I can say about that though.<br />grdaathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00722216755745063033noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1831276194138109948.post-90629621105428390822016-02-15T00:27:04.738+00:002016-02-15T00:27:04.738+00:00Such a disappointment. I've wanted the 40k sto...Such a disappointment. I've wanted the 40k story to progress in some way, but to see my beloved Wolves treated this way is such a shame. <br /><br />I would have hoped a more consolidated, carefully considered approach for such a momentous storyline. And some respect for a chapter that has survived for thousands of years protecting humanity and the imperium, from the great crusade to now. <br /><br />I want more Space Vikings than Space Wolfy Caricatures. Some of the wolf elements are great, pack hunting, tirelessly tracking a foe, the danger of a lone wolf, cunning. <br /><br />Even the curse of the 13th could have been presented and respected, ancient warriors, constant battle, reliant on their feral instincts and cunning, some succumbed to their base instincts only, how could they integrate into the chapter and the imperium, how would they react to new enemies, what have they learned of chaos, how have they stayed free from taint, what of russ himself????<br /><br />But also build on the Viking elements of strength, battle lust, warrior culture, ritual and superstition and totems, each warrior forging their own heroes saga, respect and care for the humanity they protect, proud and noble but in their own way. <br /><br />This is reflected in the new minis as well. Ulrik and Tech Priest good. Wulfen, murderfang dread, bad, caricatures. <br /><br />A missed opportunity for GW. Noodleshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01517895867295295120noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1831276194138109948.post-19890050884598269892016-02-14T10:56:14.316+00:002016-02-14T10:56:14.316+00:00More or less. Basically think three or four of tho...More or less. Basically think three or four of those happening at once, but it never gets to any of the seriously inventive stuff like in those joke skits. It's just the two throwing punches at one another and occasionally doing something slightly different.Bellariushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02652722543111095280noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1831276194138109948.post-64146717921367391712016-02-14T10:28:30.959+00:002016-02-14T10:28:30.959+00:00"Almost the entire book focuses upon mindless..."Almost the entire book focuses upon mindless violence, sheer annihilation and massive rampages which just become an inexorable tide of continual fights."<br /><br />So, what you're saying is that the book is basically a written version of Peter VS The Chicken, 'cept with Space Wolves?<br /><br />https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4WGQmWcrbsBuzzkillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09249135776018420369noreply@blogger.com